Redpill Loader information thread


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Hello,

 

I know this is the developer's room.

 

First of all, thanks to all the developers doing the amazing work on the Redpill project, it looks like is working very nicely lately, and it looks like it is an option now.

 

I know the Redpill project is considered non production ready right now, but it looks like it is being used for a lot of people. Jun's loader was considered beta at some point too, and there were not too many iterations from it, and became the production one. And I think that Redpill could have even more iterations and could be more polished than Jun's right now -I could be wrong-, as I see there are a lot more platforms to chose from.

 

I have seen is being used for a lot of people that migrate from Jun's loader info. I personally have Jun's 918+ baremetal currently.

But still, even it there is a lot of information, the threads are very confusing to follow (yes it is in developer's room, I know), but very unorganized. I posted several times and months ago in the Redpill main thread talking about this, but still there is no change about how the information is spread/organized. I don't know how to even start, and I would like to understand how this works, and what are the differences in how it works.

 

Questions:

- Is there any place with a comparison feature information redpill vs jun, to see wha tis the current status of it? Limitations/differences from each one, and know the viability of using it right now.

- Is there any place with all the installation methods (tinycore/non-tiny core and with VM/baremetal)... An ultimate guide replying to all these questions would be very appreciate it for people like me which are not OS developers and would like to start with it. Even if there are guides to follow about some of the methods, it doesn't explain the options out there of why to chose one or the other, and the difference between them.

- Is it time to put it as a viable Loader along with Jun's in the loader section?

 

This could be the place to gather all the information in detail for people who want to be informed about how this works, and maybe start with it.

 

Sorry about the place I posted this topic, and please feel free to move it to a more proper location.

Thanks,

 

E.

 

 

Edited by ed_co
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  • ed_co changed the title to Redpill Loader information thread

You make several good points.  I've had the following written up for some time but haven't posted but it appears now is the time as it overlaps with your opinion.

 

This is just my opinion, and one not even doing active development - but there are three issues that probably need resolution:

 

1. A comprehensive installation guide

2. An automated fix for the minor version upgrade procedure

3. More success data for complex installations and issue recovery

 

Regarding the latter, I am still periodically reading about how large arrays suddenly drop off.  Do we know why?  Are we sure that they are recoverable?  This is the main reason I haven't moved my production data to a new loader or DSM 7.

 

There also seems to be a move to proliferate to a lot of Synology hardware platforms.  This is good on the developer side if it enhances the available hardware ecosystem.  It's bad for testing and predictability as it has the potential to severely dilute each platform's population and issue reporting.  Personally, I'd like to see the dev community consolidate on specific platforms before calling it mainstream.

 

I will add to the Loaders and Platforms matrix when Redpill solutions are published for non-dev release.

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  • 1 month later...
On 3/16/2022 at 11:02 AM, flyride said:

3. More success data for complex installations and issue recovery

 

Regarding the latter, I am still periodically reading about how large arrays suddenly drop off.  Do we know why?  Are we sure that they are recoverable?  This is the main reason I haven't moved my production data to a new loader or DSM 7.

 

Building off this, I have noticed in the past that many users experienced issues with docker, specifically databases that cause high CPU usage. This would cause Redpill to crash, and was something @ThorGroupwas going to look into before they disapeered. Just this week, I noticed crashing behavior in Redpill when Synology Drive attempts to index a lot of files, which sucks because it makes using Synology Drive pretty unstable on Redpill, which is a major feature to be missing out on. Indexing involves database operations in DSM of course so obviously there are still stability issues in Redpill with things that involve databases unless they are small databases.

 

My concern is.... it seems that fixes to problems like that are handled in Redpill-LKM or even the base Redpill-Load. As far as I know, there have been zero developments to RP-LKM since TTG left. All of this work people have been doing lately to make installing Redpill easier like RPTC, etc. are amazing... but, they jump the gun in the sense that they are just allowing easier install of a buggy implementation of LKM. This is just going to cause headaches for everyone especially as more people install with these easy tools and then have problems like the above. I'm really hoping someone is capable of actually updating RP-LKM to make the underlying system more stable.

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All are valid points. The question is - as im not really sure - if there was ever the same for Juns loader.

 

The @ThorGroupwork is left somewhat hanging between developer and alpha release. On one side the good thing is that their work is open source and available for further development and improvement.  On the other side, there is no person or group willing to undertake the task. 

 

The issue with the crashing under heavy load was solved sometime before they went silent. At least they have tried to minimize the risk of crashing. I'm not sure though that they succeded to properly fix it.

 

Juns solution might though seem better but Syno did change a lot as well. Also with Juns loader you are stuck in 6.2.3 and you are missing application features.

 

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Indeed all points are valid but there is no going back now.

 

Whether Jun's loader was more stable or not, we are comparing apples with oranges and that ship already sailed.

 

Since ThorGroup loader is open source I want to believe when the time comes hopefully somebody will rise from the community with the necessary skills to take over...

Edited by gadreel
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  • 2 weeks later...
Posted (edited)
On 4/19/2022 at 4:30 PM, ilovepancakes said:

 

Building off this, I have noticed in the past that many users experienced issues with docker, specifically databases that cause high CPU usage. This would cause Redpill to crash, and was something @ThorGroupwas going to look into before they disapeered...

 

But is this just with docker? Or in baremetal installations happen as well? Because docker has some limitations too. If this just happens in an dockerized environments, I don't think it should be an issue. DMS itself was never thought to be something to be run inside any VM/container and IMHO, and just IF it is behaving correctly baremetal, I don't see any problem with it.

 

Another point I haven't mentioned before: I think a lot of problems which seems that are about stability, is just because there is no proper documentation, and a lot of people in the development room trying and making mistakes that wouldn't happened if there were such complete documentation, so having it, it could decimate the problems/mistakes/issues threads, which are making it to look like is more unstable that it really is (I could be wrong).

 

Edited by ed_co
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Proper documentation of the commands would be helpful.  I have noticed there are several build commands (auto, manual and static) but I have never seen a definition between all 3.  This is just one example.

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On 4/30/2022 at 9:18 PM, phone guy said:

Proper documentation of the commands would be helpful.  I have noticed there are several build commands (auto, manual and static) but I have never seen a definition between all 3.  This is just one example.

But not just documentation about a certain tool, but globally. Something which unifies every tool we need for the entire process is a must.

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