Just so you know how it went. In short it’s working thanks for your help and Jun’s latest box of tricks. The issues I had were test system was okay (clean build onto clean drive) however migration failed (code 13) and then no migrating option, then ran out of space so had to delete various update.pat. Then I went for 3617 download, forgot to generate new serial number, lots of errors. Fixed but then still could not migrate (but did have option). In the end the last thing I tried was using Synology finder to install update (which failed but put the softwhere in the right place) but could I could then use web ui to migrate keeping data but with factory settings. In the end I’m pleased with this as I know the permissions are okay with just a bit os work. So I have a Dell 780SSF with quad core processor and 4gb memory and 3 drives (two sat on top as there is not enough room) moved from 5.2x to latest 6.2 which has been able to update from Synology directly.